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Re: MALAYSIAN DIVING UNION

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MALAYSIAN DIVING UNION

Post Number:#1  Postby jonideep » Sun Jul 27, 2008 7:55 pm

GUY
LET PUT HANDS TOGETHER, LET TALK ABOUT IT.
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Re: MALAYSIAN DIVING UNION

Post Number:#2  Postby ikan Jepun » Mon Jul 28, 2008 1:37 am

i'm support to.. :glasses9:
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Re: MALAYSIAN DIVING UNION

Post Number:#3  Postby Snafu » Mon Jul 28, 2008 3:43 am

jonideep wrote:GUY
LET PUT HANDS TOGETHER, LET TALK ABOUT IT.


I read the SUBJECT but no content......what are your comment on it.

As for me, I have heard a lot coming from Commercial Divers....especially from the oldies BUT as usual NO ACTION.

What is the constitution going to be? .... Is a union right.

:D
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Re: MALAYSIAN DIVING UNION

Post Number:#4  Postby salcom » Mon Jul 28, 2008 9:07 am

set up a union to enforce on safety, welfare and rights of commercial diver in malaysia. we need to enforce this to make sure we dive safe, operate safe, protect our job (from foreigner) and a lot more.. you ppl suggest
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Re: MALAYSIAN DIVING UNION

Post Number:#5  Postby dewalaut » Mon Jul 28, 2008 10:36 am

Dear Joni
Congratulation.
Your idea about union is something that offshore diver waiting so long,  even though some of them are very busy working and counting dollar everyday.
As what Mr S K said, your " topic without content", his probably right. But to me your message is clear, your intention is want people start talking about it, isn't it? Hopefully more diver will read and give some feedback.
Union welfare and society, how you gonna start ................????

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Re: MALAYSIAN DIVING UNION

Post Number:#6  Postby bugisdiver » Mon Jul 28, 2008 12:08 pm

Syed K. A. wrote:
jonideep wrote:GUY
LET PUT HANDS TOGETHER, LET TALK ABOUT IT.


I read the SUBJECT but no content......what are your comment on it.

As for me, I have heard a lot coming from Commercial Divers....especially from the oldies BUT as usual NO ACTION.

What is the constitution going to be? .... Is a union right.

I have to agree wt u Syed,I think I know these two JB diver...& I dont think that they r serious about their own proposal. They not even well organised themselves....how could they organize something big like the Unions itself....these r bluffing &  I can bet cutting my fingernail( not my finger ya)
:violent4:
:D
Last edited by bugisdiver on Mon Jul 28, 2008 4:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: MALAYSIAN DIVING UNION

Post Number:#7  Postby jonideep » Mon Jul 28, 2008 5:48 pm

Dear Mr Bugisdiver
Frankly speaking, I never know you cos I'm from east Malaysia.
The topic that I brought may be baseless in your eyes or whatever.........
All I want is my fellow diver start THINKING about it.   
                                                     
UNION

                                                   
We did try long times ago but unfortunately when come to some stages there is a lot contra than pro, so its end-up just like that.
I'm retire soon, so before I left perhaps I could see this new generation diver with brain and energy will make sure that their right are not being manipulate by diving company.
Give simple example. when expats with no experience are paid 400 why Malaysian with 1-2 years experiences getting BELOW 350? Somemore most of them are working without work permit and not paying tax and the worst part is, it happened in Malaysia water.
He got no choice have to take it cos he need money for the family, if he got something behind to help and guide him, he for sure can get the same rates as others.
There is a lot thing happened that you probably never know some was cover by company or some individual, just to make them look good.
Believe me its all covered by diver live style. How you run your life no body cares.
Honestly I don't need to be part of UNION cos I'm SECURED  but its all for YOUNG TIGERS/DIVERS. They are going to stay in this industries 10-20 years more . I see lately, lot of Malaysian become a professional diver either ADAS/HSE. They need space to expand their carrier and times to become a good diver. If whiteman helping each others why not us?
In Malaysia we have 200 platform , just imagine if all the subsea work done by illegal workers its mean something wrong with local divers.
So Mr Bugisdiver
From the pic in the forum, you and other divers carry out NDT/ABS work on the rig. If those local have a knowledge's and capability to do it, do you think they gonna let you do the job? Same thing back here, if Malaysian can do the job let our DIVERS do it.
If you want to know the TRUTH be part of US.


Anyway it just my opinion NO HEART FEELING.  :D :D[font=Verdana][/font]

REGARDS

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Re: MALAYSIAN DIVING UNION

Post Number:#8  Postby bugisdiver » Mon Jul 28, 2008 6:09 pm

jonideep wrote:GUY
LET PUT HANDS TOGETHER, LET TALK ABOUT IT.

Dear Jonni, maybe I got the wrong person ya.....I am 49yrs old now...I dive since I was still in school...can u imagine......I think I've been there be4, thats why I say its ridiculous....if u wanna start something like this u must have someone pioneered in the industries 4 example Mr.Fatah (org lama) Mr.William A., The late Raja Adam etc. 4 instance Mr. William & his wife Ruby...he is pioneer & 5 star diver in this region. So far he approached Tgganu Gov, he setup some local facilities 4 commercial diver...have u heard bout the programme Mr. Jonni . Well theres nothing wrong wt huge ambitions.....the question is can u manage it....being united among us is out of the question k..... :D
Anyway I dont see any of ur intro in INTRODUCTION, pls intro urself 1st, u know like greetings be4 entering other ppl hse....dont u think so.............
Last edited by bugisdiver on Mon Jul 28, 2008 6:15 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: MALAYSIAN DIVING UNION

Post Number:#9  Postby jonideep » Mon Jul 28, 2008 10:15 pm

My dear Mr Bugisdiver.
What you mean by "not well organise themselves", should look into yourself mr! You been diving almost a decade but tell me what you get man?
Are you afraid?
I salute to those guy whom you mentioned for their contribution in diving, honestly I never heard their name in OIL & GAS diving industries.
Are you out of topic mr!
I don't care weather this UNION exist or not but at lease someone out there with BRAIN, CHARISMA and HONEST will start thinking about what I'm saying.
Or may be you can lead them Mr Bugisdiver?  They need someone who are very well organised.
You are damp rite mr! No intro about my self, that what I plan cos I don't want to get famous.
This is a public forum, some knowing us some are not, but don't worry the TRUTH is there...................

Well ain't got nothing to say to you anymore!  Appreciate your kind opinion.

Thanks and take care. God bless.
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Re: MALAYSIAN DIVING UNION

Post Number:#10  Postby bugisdiver » Mon Jul 28, 2008 11:12 pm

jonideep wrote:My dear Mr Bugisdiver.
What you mean by "not well organise themselves", should look into yourself mr! You been diving almost a decade but tell me what you get man?
Are you afraid?
I salute to those guy whom you mentioned for their contribution in diving, honestly I never heard their name in OIL & GAS diving industries.
Are you out of topic mr!
I don't care weather this UNION exist or not but at lease someone out there with BRAIN, CHARISMA and HONEST will start thinking about what I'm saying.
Or may be you can lead them Mr Bugisdiver?  They need someone who are very well organised.
You are damp rite mr! No intro about my self, that what I plan cos I don't want to get famous.
This is a public forum, some knowing us some are not, but don't worry the TRUTH is there...................

Well ain't got nothing to say to you anymore!  Appreciate your kind opinion.

Thanks and take care. God bless.


Well .at first, when Isaw ur post & Im sure i know who u r coz of ur handle & one stupid supporter after ur post...they always get along...if u r not that person ..I apologise......regarding what do I have
I have a house , a car 7 two Mcycle living in JB is not easy man, U live in kampung cost of living not as high here in JB.  KL much cheaper than JB arr another thing  living alone in JB is high cost living...pls do not make any comparison....if ur in my shoe ...u will knowhow hard it is...

Adios Amigos I berambus
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Re: MALAYSIAN DIVING UNION

Post Number:#11  Postby bigjoe74 » Tue Jul 29, 2008 1:49 am

:crybaby2:
Basic - to make union we need to united but how can we make union if we not united and start to blame between each other.
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dive in safe manner....
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Re: MALAYSIAN DIVING UNION

Post Number:#12  Postby ikan Jepun » Tue Jul 29, 2008 1:54 am

betul tu bang..apa nak jadi dengan bugisdiver ni!!!!!!....more respect...
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Re: MALAYSIAN DIVING UNION

Post Number:#13  Postby bigjoe74 » Tue Jul 29, 2008 2:20 am

i dont want to blame anybody. We all equak. No hero and no number 1. Let cheer up . Let make this community strong.:glasses9:
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dive in safe manner....
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Re: MALAYSIAN DIVING UNION

Post Number:#14  Postby Snafu » Tue Jul 29, 2008 3:05 am

Dear Commercial Divers,

You guys are funny so let's stick to the topic of setting up a UNION for Commercial Divers.

I dont know if any of you knows about UNION, but lets start with the Malaysia Diving Union CONSTITUTION.

Constitution is what a UNION is base on, so lets hear it from all the NO experience, LITTLE experience & MANY experience Commercial Diver.

1. What is the CONSTITUTION for Malaysia Diving Union going to be???

2. How are the UNION going to get support from majority of Commercial Divers?
- Looking in this thread alone make me wonder if i should laugh or cry... i choose to  :laughing11:

3. Can the members make the payment of RM2000 est. per person a year
- This money will go for paying lawyers...etc

3. Having a union does not mean we have support from the Government
- We need 100% support from them
- We need Private sector to support us...even by FORCE

4. What about Commercial Divers from SINGAPORE
- How this UNION going to operate around it...IS MALAYSIA Diving Union right.

More to come but lets start by answering the above question.

FYI..Running this forum also is not an easy task, makes it worst when some of the members have own personal interest...  :P whatever that is.

Lets keep this thread running & see where is it going, I hope the reply I get after this will be constructive & positive which may lead into forming the Malaysia Diving Union.

Please feel free to INVITE more Commercial divers so we can discuss more about it.

As for why foreign diver working in Malaysia water ....next time PLEASE see the vessel or barge flag & registration, if is not MALAYSIA .... they can have crew from anywhere around the WORLD & PLANET....ask the local and foreign petroleum company that allow it to happen.

As for the training centre in Trengganu....Is ONLY good if it have recognition from the Offshore Bodies like HSE, if you going to ask why must it be HSE...is going to take me long time to explain & I dont have that much of a time to do so.

I can tolerate ignorance, if we not sure about something do find out & share it.....this will make us united.

There is NO Stupid Question, ONLY Stupid Answer.... so ask!

Specially to Jonideep - PLEASE introduce yourself in the introduction section, thank you...please make it short & sweet.

:D
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Re: MALAYSIAN DIVING UNION

Post Number:#15  Postby dewalaut » Tue Jul 29, 2008 1:12 pm

RM2K. KARPAL SINGH mau ka? he he he..................  :laughing11:
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Re: MALAYSIAN DIVING UNION

Post Number:#16  Postby Snafu » Wed Jul 30, 2008 12:01 am

dewalaut wrote:RM2K. KARPAL SINGH mau ka? he he he..................  :laughing11:


You dont even know his rate so PLEASE stick to the topic.

:D
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Re: MALAYSIAN DIVING UNION

Post Number:#17  Postby jonideep » Wed Jul 30, 2008 5:45 am

To Mr S K

MY MISSION ACCOMPLISH.

YOU GUY ALREADY START TALKING ABOUT IT. MORE FEEDBACK, GUIDELINE, QUESTIONS AND STUPID ANSWER .

TRYING TO INVITE ALL THE DIVERS I KNOW TO THIS OFFSHORE FORUM.
THIS IS THE LAST AND THE ONLY THING THAT JONI CAN CONTRIBUTE TO THIS SMALL COMMUNITY.

JONIDEEP  :laughing11:
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Re: MALAYSIAN DIVING UNION

Post Number:#18  Postby Spazm » Wed Jul 30, 2008 9:58 am

Hello all,

I am new in the industry and would like to know what is the status of this Diving Union ?

First and foremost, is there a Union that is currently registered or is this just a discussion on how to start one?
Substance over matter , Diver behind the dive.....
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Re: MALAYSIAN DIVING UNION

Post Number:#19  Postby ikan » Wed Jul 30, 2008 11:31 am

jonideep wrote:To Mr S K

MY MISSION ACCOMPLISH.

YOU GUY ALREADY START TALKING ABOUT IT. MORE FEEDBACK, GUIDELINE, QUESTIONS AND STUPID ANSWER .

TRYING TO INVITE ALL THE DIVERS I KNOW TO THIS OFFSHORE FORUM.
THIS IS THE LAST AND THE ONLY THING THAT JONI CAN CONTRIBUTE TO THIS SMALL COMMUNITY.

JONIDEEP  :laughing11:


Bro .. try not to write capital letters. In this cyberworld it is considered as shouting and people might read your messages in a menacing tone ...
if u are going to be dumb, u better be tough ....
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Re: MALAYSIAN DIVING UNION

Post Number:#20  Postby Snafu » Wed Jul 30, 2008 11:59 am

Spazm wrote:Hello all,

I am new in the industry and would like to know what is the status of this Diving Union ?

First and foremost, is there a Union that is currently registered or is this just a discussion on how to start one?



Status : Nothing

Union is just in discussion mode from long time ago, infact Mr. Jonideep & some of his fellow diver friend tried but failed BIG TIME as he cant convince divers & himself to be united at that time.

Not only that, greed...selfish...BACK STABBER...are one of the point of failure for the 'Union', divers feeling ALONE having to fight problem without any help from so call fellow divers.

Divers that you think is your friend start stabbing your back the moment you turn your head around  :laughing11: Plenty of this  :P

NATO is one of the biggest problem  :laughing11: No Action Talk Only  :laughing11:

:D
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Re: MALAYSIAN DIVING UNION

Post Number:#21  Postby Snafu » Thu Jul 31, 2008 7:17 pm

jonideep wrote:To Mr S K

MY MISSION ACCOMPLISH.

YOU GUY ALREADY START TALKING ABOUT IT. MORE FEEDBACK, GUIDELINE, QUESTIONS AND STUPID ANSWER .

TRYING TO INVITE ALL THE DIVERS I KNOW TO THIS OFFSHORE FORUM.
THIS IS THE LAST AND THE ONLY THING THAT JONI CAN CONTRIBUTE TO THIS SMALL COMMUNITY.

JONIDEEP  :laughing11:


NATO...hohoho
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Re: MALAYSIAN DIVING UNION

Post Number:#22  Postby sisedut » Thu Jul 31, 2008 10:12 pm

hi, i m not a diver. like i said earlier in my introduction, someone email me to log in here.
of all d post in this forum i have read. only this CDs corner are truly SAD people in here including the CD moderator as well. i thought that this forum are to help & give guidance to everyone, no matter you are senior or junior divers among you all. if this is the attitude of starting up a union, might as well don't discuss. as for the moderator, you seem to be so smart & literate. please guide them to some sense.
actually on the other hand, why not you get the union start. a smart man like you sir, could do more help for those who needs the union. do you ?
i can see some picture why some CDs don't want to be in the union because they are secure & retiree. money is no objection for all the CDs to get it start. is it ?
hope the union get start soon.
all the best.
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Re: MALAYSIAN DIVING UNION

Post Number:#23  Postby Snafu » Thu Jul 31, 2008 11:13 pm

sisedut wrote:hi, i m not a diver. like i said earlier in my introduction, someone email me to log in here.
of all d post in this forum i have read. only this CDs corner are truly SAD people in here including the CD moderator as well. i thought that this forum are to help & give guidance to everyone, no matter you are senior or junior divers among you all. if this is the attitude of starting up a union, might as well don't discuss. as for the moderator, you seem to be so smart & literate. please guide them to some sense.
actually on the other hand, why not you get the union start. a smart man like you sir, could do more help for those who needs the union. do you ?
i can see some picture why some CDs don't want to be in the union because they are secure & retiree. money is no objection for all the CDs to get it start. is it ?
hope the union get start soon.
all the best.


Indeed the CD's r SAD people & that include me  :laughing11:

I can live with it without having to rant about UNION and UNION need the divers 1st before it can do any help.

Look around...where is the voice of the divers??? Where is the feedback??

I am not in a position to start anything after all I dont have the brain to do so... maybe Mr. Jonideep can do so.

Anyway thanks for dropping by & giving your input.

:D

:D
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Re: MALAYSIAN DIVING UNION

Post Number:#24  Postby wilhurricane » Fri Aug 01, 2008 12:26 pm

Hi,
  Just curious.... how did other country diving union started? Maybe we can used the same approach? 
Water!!! :)
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Re: MALAYSIAN DIVING UNION

Post Number:#25  Postby John F SeaDemon » Fri Aug 01, 2008 4:08 pm

Hmm...after a long time of silence...somewhat.

You guys have got a good thing going here.  First of all, I would agree that having a union will do good for dive professionals: not just CDs, but also for recreational and technical dive professionals.  However, Syed is correct in saying that all this while it has been NATO.  There is no unity amongst divers, therefore how are we to have a union?  There is no one standard that we can follow here in Malaysia.  We may have a foreign-registered/flagged vessel with lots of foreign divers, anchored/positioned somewhere off Malaysia, doing work, but hardly any Malaysian CDs on board. Likewise, we see a lot of DCs (dive centers) in Malaysia operated and/or, managed by non-locals.  Maybe we should start asking ourselves why is this happening. Is it because we have no union to represent us that we have no standard asking price?  And those foreigners have a standard set of rate per day and easy for the principal to calculate how much to pay per day for all? Or is it the work quality from one local CD to another local CD varies? Maybe we speak English in a different intonation that they have a difficult time understanding and communicating with us; and for fear of wasting deployment money having to redo certain things, they might as well get foreign divers who speak English well and can get the job done in lesser number of hours!  Before you start jumping, look at the number of postings in Malay in this topic alone.  I would expect CDs to have a better command of English, or if it needs to be broken, let it be in a manner that can be understood by others, especially by the foreign visitors and members to this forum.

Secondly, CDs and other dive professionals alike do not have any form of representation in the government services.  Is there an OSHA chapter that covers diving in detail?  We do not even have a body to investigate divers' death or if equipment failure is involved. So what standards do we plan to achieve?  A way to get this achieved is through representation - a union.  Then we can have some kind of standards based on the HSE, and we can get accreditation from HSE, and we can start training CDs locally, at a cheaper price, to supply them to local O&G companies first, and foreign companies after.  Only with a union can we set a base price, or rates according to certification.  With standards, we can have safety regulations pertaining to ALL kinds of diving. We can have dive centers to adhere to a minimum standard. As it is, it is very scary to go diving in Malaysia just to be able to look at some stupid-looking Nemo because if something screws up, none or very few of the boats carry O2 on board, very little form of two-way communications apart from lifting the middle finger at other dive operators and getting the same response from the other party.  So what are we talking about here?

Until a union is set-up, there is no point in complaining about foreign-divers working here.  As it is, we already have so many deaths of BERNAS-trained divers from Thailand dying in the mountains of the Titiwangsa range due to DCI and other barometric and dive-related problems.

I only dive for commercials.  So it is up to you people to unify and form a union!

Find me somewhere in the Tebrau strait la...most of the time I am there la.
-If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying-
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Re: MALAYSIAN DIVING UNION

Post Number:#26  Postby AdRiaN cHuA » Fri Aug 01, 2008 4:22 pm

My suggestion is before starting up Diving Union, let us start up CDs club. From there we can accumulate members, thinking of what to do and how to do it.

For me the main thing is "We stand together", I don't know why is hard for us to stand together to fight for better future. Have you guy heard of the story of chopstick - is easy to break when it stand alone. I totally new to this field, I know nothing about offshore, all I knew is about tuna farming and aqulculture work only.

First of all, I would like to know how many CD here, who agree and who again.

Name of CDs and agree or again
1. Adrian Chua (Aqualculture diver and soon will upgrade to ADAS part III) - Agree
2.
3.
4.
5.
6.
7.
8.
9.
10.
11.

And so on.....
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Re: MALAYSIAN DIVING UNION

Post Number:#27  Postby AdRiaN cHuA » Fri Aug 01, 2008 4:29 pm

John F SeaDemon wrote:
Until a union is set-up, there is no point in complaining about foreign-divers working here.  As it is, we already have so many deaths of BERNAS-trained divers from Thailand dying in the mountains of the Titiwangsa range due to DCI and other barometric and dive-related problems.



SeaDemon can you explain more on this...I'm new to this field..thank :)
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Re: MALAYSIAN DIVING UNION

Post Number:#28  Postby wilhurricane » Fri Aug 01, 2008 4:58 pm

In aquaculture diving, which is totally new in this country, the company (my company) always thinks we're over paid and for your information we're not even getting 10% of what offshore is paying per day, there are times we need to do bounce dive just to get the job done coz things are so frus and . no dive safety guideline or proper emergency evacuation for us, for example if we diver f***ked up in high sea, no chopper will come and fetch you, the company will only send a vessel out to pick you up and bring you in, which gonna take 7 day journey in total. Getting portable camber or even more 02 tanks is a financial burden to them but they can sit in the office with new chairs and new tables... SO any S**t happens, here divers  better get their money to buy own coffin.

Now they planning to get people that didn't go thru proper training to do the diving job. :crybaby2: :crybaby2:

They are now "cutting off their nose to spite their face", and to be frank I'm now running for my life and will not look back unless  -harley-

S*IT... must be a way to help CD around in the future. I'm sure in future some CD mite end up in aquaculture diving in malaysia, and if the company running like this would only get people killed.
Water!!! :)
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Re: MALAYSIAN DIVING UNION

Post Number:#29  Postby necrosis » Thu Aug 07, 2008 2:36 am

Good Day everyone!

I am a Singaporean commercial diving supervisor, currently working in Saudi. Haven't been in the diving industry long but in my 12 years of plying my trade a salvage diver, inspection diver, lst and diving supervisor in the inshore, offshore, marine salvage industry as far as West Africa and Russia, I've seen quite a lot of characters amongst divers and also diving companies.

A union in the Malaysian commercial diving industry is a good way of protecting the interest of Malaysian divers. But...the very main word is "UNITY". All Malaysian divers in the commercial diving community must unite and look in the same direction. Divers must also constantly upgrade themselves. Example, if they are adequate inspection divers in Malaysia (3.1u & 3.2U), then Malaysian diving companies won't be bringing in Indian divers to do subsea NDT works. And talking about Indian divers working in Malaysia, they are actually bringing the daily rates down! Here in Saudi, 3.1U are earning USD 450-550 a day, in Malaysia, Indian divers are only asking for USD 250-350 and some would settle for even lesser. If they are earning that amount of money, how u people reckon Indian air divers are being paid? And that brings us to Diving Companies, they are always trying to bite big chunks from divers. If divers are not united, I've seen a lot, when companies offer ridiculously small amount of money, most people don't wanna accept but they are some divers who accepts. For as long as these small percentage of divers who work for "peanuts", you will still get "monkeys" in the diving industries. And the rates will never go up. Now before people starts screaming at me, dat peanuts and monkeys thingy is happening ALL AROUND THE WORLD, not just in Malaysia. So, pls don't misquote me.

Another good example:
I was on job in Terengganu last year with Intraline on HD-60 as a diving supervisor and sad to say, on my shift, all my divers are from UK and Australia. Intraline also operates on a Clough offshore vessel where they did sat and majority of the divers are Brits and Aussies. I was asking around, why is this possible? Are there no Malaysian divers available for jobs at that moment? And well, the man in-charge of diving operations in the office is a New Zealander. So, you put two and two together, u'll get the answer. That explains why no Malaysian divers on the job. As for why I got the job is coz the South African diving supervisor walked out of the job and I was able to mobilise at very short notice.

So, a Malaysian Diving Union is a good thingy. You will need a very good lawyer, he will have to be very familiar with commercial diving works. If you don't get actual support from the Government, you will need people who have influence with diving companies. You will need more qualified divers (inspection etc). Union members must also be disciplined in paying their dues cost its not going to be small amount yearly. And most of all, you all need to unite, if one says NO, everyone in the union must say NO.

Just my 2 cents worth of views.


Dive Safe peeps



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Rudie Haque
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Re: MALAYSIAN DIVING UNION

Post Number:#30  Postby Snafu » Thu Aug 07, 2008 3:52 am

Well said Rudie!!!

UNITE & we stand tall!!!

:D
Some people are only ALIVE because it's against the law to KILL them...really!!!
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