Author Topic: Run out of air situation- Will the air from BC hel (Read 1946 times)

adik · « **on:** May 13, 2007, 12:22:44 PM »

Run out off air situation ... will the air from your BC helps???

Q :- You are at 25 mtr, lost your buddy, run out off air , CESA is the best option.

Would you guys breath some air that might expand upon accending from your BC???
Will the air trap in the BC contiminated??

Ppl said better to slightly overweight, slightly negative, bcoz you will inflate a little bit once you reach the bottom to get nuetral and have some air in your BC probably 3-5 breath of mixture of gas (god know what sort of mixture- O2, N2, Co2) that might save you life aprt from CESA.

I hope myself not being in a position to do CESA at all , but just incase this situation happen to me, what is the best option????

GOD · « **Reply #1 on:** May 13, 2007, 02:54:56 PM »

If it able to give you some air to keep you alive .... is survival.... worry about getting TB, Lung Infection...etc after you survive.

Being slightly negative are good, you would fill your BCD with air once you at bottom .... as soon as you ditch your weight belts, you be positive & will start ascending with very less effort.

If this situation happen to you, by now you can always BUY SPARE AIR ... after all your underwater video equipment cost RM20K +++.

You can get for back up, Spare air(i dont like it) .... 2L-3L cylinder with 1st & 2nd stage(I prefer this o[tion)

hehheheheheheheeeee..... you should have one, remember SIPADAN.

;D

SeaDemon · « **Reply #2 on:** May 13, 2007, 04:30:27 PM »

As they say where I come from: "Stercus accidit!" ;D ;D ;D

The first thing I would say is NEVER NEVER EVER PUT YOURSELF IN THIS DIRE SITUATION...so always check your gauge and make it a habit to check at least once in every ten minutes.

But of course, there are those masochists who go by my kampung folks' saying above. If that happens, I would be in a bad situation because I never blow my BC using the air from my tank. Then again, what you breathe out is not purely CO2..there would, I guess and I stand corrected, good amount of unused O2. So, yes, I would take one breathe of that air and perform my CESA and hope I don't black out from sudden surge of CO2 in my system. On the way up, I breathe out slowly, making bubbles from my mouth and pray no bubbles are formed within my system.

Snafu has given the other tips like dumping the weight belt (expensive option for those with weight-integrated BCD but if you value your life more, it becomes cheap ;D ;D) and so on.

zzz · « **Reply #3 on:** May 13, 2007, 06:23:58 PM »

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Then again, what you breathe out is not purely CO2..there would, I guess and I stand corrected, good amount of unused O2. So, yes, I would take one breathe of that air and perform my CESA and hope I don't black out from sudden surge of CO2 in my system. On the way up, I breathe out slowly, making bubbles from my mouth and pray no bubbles are formed within my system.
.

Fyi.. Content of exhaled air is roughly 16% O2 and 4% CO2...compared to 21% and 0.3% in the normal air.. Should be ok for just ONE gulp of breath. Btw SD, I thought that you'll pass out if you have less CO2 like in hyperventilation ... ahh... have to re-check the physiology books..I may have misunderstood

GOD · « **Reply #4 on:** May 13, 2007, 11:12:55 PM »

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Fyi.. Content of exhaled air is roughly 16% O2 and 4% CO2...compared to 21% and 0.3% in the normal air.. Should be ok for just ONE gulp of breath. Btw SD, I thought that you'll pass out if you have less CO2 like in hyperventilation ... ahh... have to re-check the physiology books..I may have misunderstood

Errrrr.... we breath coz of CO2... amount of O2 left in the air varies from diver to diver.

As you might have known, our bcd ...air cell...air bladder are not that clean, air in the bcd might not pass the air purity test :o so as you ascend, the air will expend SO DOES CO2 level which might get to alarming state that you are not able to do anything even when your brains tells you what to do.... loss of motor skill, shallow breathing...etc.

;D

jgshuwei · « **Reply #5 on:** May 13, 2007, 11:36:03 PM »

For me, I will just take any air that I have, don't care about CO2 level or what liao. Every breath is so important during CESA.

superkingkong · « **Reply #6 on:** May 14, 2007, 02:18:51 AM »

that is why.. in US... pony is so popular

a 19cf pony is recommended,...

but leceh lah.. additional things (extra mini tank to be carried down :

and then they come out with spare air abt 3cf... and i would rather call it spare breathe.. coz u can take few breathe out of it only...but when u dont have air... with just a breathe or 2 ... u will appreciate it a lot :

SeaDemon · « **Reply #7 on:** May 14, 2007, 02:29:58 AM »

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For me, I will just take any air that I have, don't care aout CO2 level or what liao. Every breath is so important during CESA.

Ditto

superkingkong · « **Reply #8 on:** May 14, 2007, 02:35:44 AM »

as saying goes.. eat now worry later.... in the aspect of OOA, it will be "breath now, worry later" ;D

adik · « **Reply #9 on:** May 14, 2007, 03:11:00 AM »

SKK .. yeah my friend told me pony bottle quite famous in the states.

Snuf and SD : Is there any possibility that a 0 bar tank (tottaly run out of air) at 25 mtr can
have few more air upon accending ???? or at the 1st stage, or at the host and the primary 2nd stage

SeaDemon · « **Reply #10 on:** May 14, 2007, 03:21:00 AM »

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SKK .. yeah my friend told me pony bottle quite famous in the states.

Snuf and SD : Is there any possibility that a 0 bar tank (tottaly run out of air) at 25 mtr can
have few more air upon accending ???? or at the 1st stage, or at the host and the primary 2nd stage

Well, there is some air in the first stage providing you have not sucked up any air after the gauge turned 0. On my last trip my Din to yoke connector came loose and air leaked out. By the time the dive guide got to me and checked my gauge, it was already zero. I declined her octopus, I deployed my SMB, made my way up slowly to 5m and performed my safety stop...the dive guide and Deepblu close to me.

After three minutes of controlled breathing (decreased rate), the air finally ran out and I surfaced.

Of course I'd add: Please don't try this and don't put yourself in this position.

adik · « **Reply #11 on:** May 14, 2007, 03:33:17 AM »

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SKK .. yeah my friend told me pony bottle quite famous in the states.

Snuf and SD : Is there any possibility that a 0 bar tank (tottaly run out of air) at 25 mtr can
have few more air upon accending ???? or at the 1st stage, or at the host and the primary 2nd stage

Well, there is some air in the first stage providing you have not sucked up any air after the gauge turned 0. On my last trip my Din to yoke connector came loose and air leaked out. By the time the dive guide got to me and checked my gauge, it was already zero. I declined her octopus, I deployed my SMB, made my way up slowly to 5m and performed my safety stop...the dive guide and Deepblu close to me.

After three minutes of controlled breathing (decreased rate), the air finally ran out and I surfaced.

Of course I'd add: Please don't try this and don't put yourself in this position.

At what depth is this???

Dont worry I will not put myself in this position, just want to know how air works underpreasure.

Din valve use screw right??? Cannot remember in OWD they show the different type of valves ..

SeaDemon · « **Reply #12 on:** May 14, 2007, 03:40:27 AM »

Between 18m-20m

superkingkong · « **Reply #13 on:** May 14, 2007, 06:10:38 AM »

hmmm... u r saying that ur pressure gauge is 0 at 20m... but u still got air to deploy smb and ascent to 5m for safety stop?

SeaDemon · « **Reply #14 on:** May 14, 2007, 12:07:26 PM »

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hmmm... u r saying that ur pressure gauge is 0 at 20m... but u still got air to deploy smb and ascent to 5m for safety stop?

Yes. I never use my octopus to deploy my SMB. Virtually a No-No in tech diving.

HoleMaster · « **Reply #15 on:** May 14, 2007, 12:18:22 PM »

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hmmm... u r saying that ur pressure gauge is 0 at 20m... but u still got air to deploy smb and ascent to 5m for safety stop?

Yes. I never use my octopus to deploy my SMB. Virtually a No-No in tech diving.

Wei brudder SD, wat happened until u ran out of air? Another could u pls shed some light why it is No No to deply SMB with Octo?

HoleMaster · « **Reply #16 on:** May 14, 2007, 12:18:45 PM »

i mean in tech diving

superkingkong · « **Reply #17 on:** May 14, 2007, 01:05:03 PM »

hehe.. holemaster... i was going to ask that

btw.. SD... if u say u r 0 at 20m.... where can u still got air to breath and ascent to 5m to do safety stop some more?

sorry... i might have misunderstood u.

thanks.

SeaDemon · « **Reply #18 on:** May 14, 2007, 08:15:23 PM »

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Quote
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hmmm... u r saying that ur pressure gauge is 0 at 20m... but u still got air to deploy smb and ascent to 5m for safety stop?

Yes. I never use my octopus to deploy my SMB. Virtually a No-No in tech diving.

Wei brudder SD, wat happened until u ran out of air? Another could u pls shed some light why it is No No to deply SMB with Octo?

Why waste good air that can help keep you alive?

SeaDemon · « **Reply #19 on:** May 14, 2007, 08:16:12 PM »

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hehe.. holemaster... i was going to ask that

btw.. SD... if u say u r 0 at 20m.... where can u still got air to breath and ascent to 5m to do safety stop some more?

sorry... i might have misunderstood u.

thanks.

Air expands as you go up.

superkingkong · « **Reply #20 on:** May 15, 2007, 09:54:43 AM »

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Quote
hehe.. holemaster... i was going to ask that

btw.. SD... if u say u r 0 at 20m.... where can u still got air to breath and ascent to 5m to do safety stop some more?

sorry... i might have misunderstood u.

thanks.

Air expands as you go up.

kekeee... true .. thanks

hmm.. btw. .a silly question again... is it that... when u r at 30m.. your presure gauge show u 0... which means no air... but when u ascent to 20m, and since the theory says that u will have air and that air expands... will ur pressure gauge increase by a few bar indicating that u have air? :-?

SeaDemon · « **Reply #21 on:** May 15, 2007, 10:06:02 AM »

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Quote
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hehe.. holemaster... i was going to ask that

btw.. SD... if u say u r 0 at 20m.... where can u still got air to breath and ascent to 5m to do safety stop some more?

sorry... i might have misunderstood u.

thanks.

Air expands as you go up.

kekeee... true .. thanks

hmm.. btw. .a silly question again... is it that... when u r at 30m.. your presure gauge show u 0... which means no air... but when u ascent to 20m, and since the theory says that u will have air and that air expands... will ur pressure gauge increase by a few bar indicating that u have air? :-?

Hmm...why don't you go down with Erra Fazira to 600m? You will know you will run out of air easily. Then tell me if air will expand.

My pressure gauge was always at 0. Like I said, don't try this at home.

adik · « **Reply #22 on:** May 15, 2007, 10:19:16 AM »

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Quote
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hehe.. holemaster... i was going to ask that

btw.. SD... if u say u r 0 at 20m.... where can u still got air to breath and ascent to 5m to do safety stop some more?

sorry... i might have misunderstood u.

thanks.

Air expands as you go up.

kekeee... true .. thanks

hmm.. btw. .a silly question again... is it that... when u r at 30m.. your presure gauge show u 0... which means no air... but when u ascent to 20m, and since the theory says that u will have air and that air expands... will ur pressure gauge increase by a few bar indicating that u have air? :-?

Hmm...why don't you go down with Erra Fazira to 600m? You will know you will run out of air easily. Then tell me if air will expand.

My pressure gauge was always at 0. Like I said, don't try this at home.

I will never try this and never experience this as well, but I think it will not move the needle at the SPG at all, but adequate 3-5 breath upon accending as air expand in the tank.

superkingkong · « **Reply #23 on:** May 15, 2007, 11:20:19 AM »

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Quote
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hehe.. holemaster... i was going to ask that

btw.. SD... if u say u r 0 at 20m.... where can u still got air to breath and ascent to 5m to do safety stop some more?

sorry... i might have misunderstood u.

thanks.

Air expands as you go up.

kekeee... true .. thanks

hmm.. btw. .a silly question again... is it that... when u r at 30m.. your presure gauge show u 0... which means no air... but when u ascent to 20m, and since the theory says that u will have air and that air expands... will ur pressure gauge increase by a few bar indicating that u have air? :-?

Hmm...why don't you go down with Erra Fazira to 600m? You will know you will run out of air easily. Then tell me if air will expand.

My pressure gauge was always at 0. Like I said, don't try this at home.

sorry if i have understood you wrongly.

i know that air will expand from 30m to 20m ... but my question is will a spg shows that ? ... like showing 0bar at 30m.. but when u r at 20m... the needle will show maybe 10bar or something...? or is it the needle still showing 0bar but u have a bit of air to breath?

thanks

SeaDemon · « **Reply #24 on:** May 15, 2007, 11:22:59 AM »

I dunno la. Maybe if have 1 BAR at 30m, then on surface it should show 4 BAR. Correct? But can see 4 BAR on gauge meh?

adik · « **Reply #25 on:** May 15, 2007, 11:43:24 AM »

Ya lah... cannot see right . Unless like yours SD, with transmitter can see kan????

SD what is the average breath per bar per diver assuming at 20 mtr. Any chance to get this info ??

I know it varies among divers, subject to thier consumption.
To answer SKK question I also wonder how. As yu go up the air expand, to determine how many bar left, we dont know because our SPGs not indicating it, all you know suddenly still air comes in from your reg,

From technical perspective .. what is your thoughts

SeaDemon · « **Reply #26 on:** May 15, 2007, 12:30:58 PM »

Hehe..I don't use a transmitter. Remember? I don't believe in electronics mixing with water.

Average breath per BAR per diver...you can get that from the SAC rate/RMV of the diver.

superkingkong · « **Reply #27 on:** May 15, 2007, 02:40:16 PM »

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Hehe..I don't use a transmitter. Remember? I don't believe in electronics mixing with water.

Average breath per BAR per diver...you can get that from the SAC rate/RMV of the diver.

what is RMV?

sorry.

superkingkong · « **Reply #28 on:** May 15, 2007, 02:44:24 PM »

Just want to find this out

if your spg showing u 0bar at 30m.... when u go up to 20m, air will expand, hence u still can breath from it... but will your spg shows u that u still have air?

will the needle move a little bit upon ascending?

thx

SeaDemon · « **Reply #29 on:** May 15, 2007, 03:00:14 PM »

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Quote
Hehe..I don't use a transmitter. Remember? I don't believe in electronics mixing with water.

Average breath per BAR per diver...you can get that from the SAC rate/RMV of the diver.

what is RMV?

sorry.

Respiratory Minute Volume

Author Topic: Run out of air situation- Will the air from BC hel (Read 1946 times)

adik

GOD

SeaDemon

zzz

GOD

jgshuwei

superkingkong

SeaDemon

superkingkong

adik

SeaDemon

adik

SeaDemon

superkingkong

SeaDemon

HoleMaster

HoleMaster

superkingkong

SeaDemon

SeaDemon

superkingkong

SeaDemon

adik

superkingkong

SeaDemon

adik

SeaDemon

superkingkong

superkingkong

SeaDemon